Diary of a Matchmaker

Secrets to Building Wealth Before Marriage w/ Areeb Khawaja

• Halal Match • Episode 85

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What if the real glow-up before marriage isn’t skincare… it’s your bank account? Most of us grew up hearing “just save” with zero clue how money actually grows, moves, and works for you. In this episode, financial educator and consultant Areeb Khawaja spills the secrets no one in our communities explains, the quiet moves that build wealth before the marriage talks even begin. 

Think: the accounts nobody told you about, the small habits that snowball into freedom, the creative ways to minimise your taxes, and the halal pathways that grow your money without guilt. It’s not a lecture, it’s the money talk you wish someone gave you at 20. If you’re a single Muslim who wants clarity, confidence, and a financial head start, this one’s your blueprint.

Connect with Areeb for FREE financial literacy sessions through his email: areebkhawaja1@gmail.com 

If something we said made you think, laugh, or feel seen, leave us a rating and review! It helps more people find the show. And hey, if you know someone who needs to hear this episode, send it their way. Sharing is caring!


SPEAKER_01:

Assalamu alaikum. I'm Hibah.

SPEAKER_03:

And I'm Zayd.

SPEAKER_01:

You're listening to Diary of a Matchmaker.

SPEAKER_03:

A podcast that will take you into our world as matchmakers.

SPEAKER_01:

We'll share our experiences and offer advice for the single Muslim.

SPEAKER_03:

So let's dive in. Bismillah. Alright, Bismillah. As salamu alaikum, everyone. Rabbi Shahli Sadhi was Silly Amri Bahl Uqtatamil Sani Yafkahu Kawli. Welcome to another episode. I'm Zayd, and on the other mic is my wife and co-host Hiba. Um so we just received this story today, and uh I'll just jump right into it. So back when I was in university, I went on a cottage trip with some friends. And I made what I now call the second most expensive mistake of my early twenties. I was on a jet ski feeling a little too confident, and let's just say the jet ski won the fight. I didn't crash it, I crashed my bank account too. After paying for the damages, I had nothing left for next month's rent. Zero. So I scrambled and took the first part-time job I could find at a small startup. My manager was let's call him the opposite of supportive. Six weeks later, as the COVID pandemic hit and the company didn't make any sales, I got laid off. No savings, no backup plan, and a lot of anxiety. But honestly, that moment changed everything for me. It was the fur it was my first real lesson in personal finance. The importance of an emergency fund and why financial stability isn't just about money, it's about dignity, security, and peace of mind. That experience shaped my entire approach to teaching financial literacy today. So Arib, how did your parents take that uh incident? I'm guessing that well.

SPEAKER_04:

Oh, well, thank you for sharing that. Alhamdulillah, you know, one of the things that we're uh grateful for is that nobody was harmed. Uh there was no, you know, no one was hurt from that experience, nobody was harmed. Uh Alhamdulillah, I made it out uh unscathed, uh, without a scrap without a scratch. And that's I think that's one of the things that we're most grateful for. So I think, you know, from that perspective, my parents were very grateful. And you know, we we took the ride back home from that trip a a lot more um uh you know, happier that you know, alhamdulillah, we had come out of this okay. I had come out of this okay, nobody else has got gotten hurt. I think from my perspective, one of the things that uh I still think to uh and to this day, think about to this day, is that you know anything could have happened on that jet scene.

SPEAKER_01:

So Wow, where where where was this?

SPEAKER_04:

This was one of the cottages I can't remember um the name, but I can get back to you on that. It's actually in Ontario.

SPEAKER_01:

Oh, in Canada, okay. I thought it's somewhere in the Caribbean or something.

SPEAKER_04:

No, no, it was here. Um I could get away with a lot more if it was in the Caribbean, but it was here. But the the lesson from all of that, like the jet ski experience on its own was one thing, I must say. Like, you know, there was that exhilaration, that feeling of dread, oh my god, what's going to happen now? Now we have to pay for the damages that have happened to the jet ski and to the other guy's boat, right? And these damages aren't cheap, right? Um, so alhamdulillah, after taking care of that, I was able to pay for that, but I had no money left over for rent for you know the next month because I was in university, I was just a student, I wasn't working full-time at that time. Uh, and you know, there was I had no concept of an emergency fund or having savings at that point. And I remember thinking to myself, oh my god, like how am I going to be able to afford to stay here? There's nothing I can do. So I had to, I did what you know what I did what I I knew best. I got another job, right? I messaged as many people I knew to like see if I can work a connection and get a referral and get into one company and apply as many places as possible. Alhamdulillah, it worked out for me and I was able to get a job. And that's the other thing that I want people to take away from this lesson as well is when you don't feel financially secure, you end up taking on, you know, uh positions and roles out of desperation instead of out of what you want to do. So that role was not, you know, the best fit for me either. I ended up being in a position where my manager wasn't, you know, a very supportive manager. He was kind of a micromanager type personality. Uh, he would call me every 10 minutes to check up on how I was doing in my work. And you know, he didn't trust anything, you know, so he would have to verify everything that I was doing. And I just felt very, you know, uh put down from this entire experience of having to work with him. And not only that, but then you know, six weeks, this was like early January um in 2020. So just six weeks after that, you know, the lockdown was announced, and this company was, you know, um they did home renovations for um for people. Uh, and so because of the lockdowns, they couldn't go out and do the home renovations anymore. So they were no, they weren't gonna make any sales. The company was losing money, and they had to they had to let me go. So now I lost that job as well. So it was like a whole, you know, that one experience, that one mistake of that jet ski, which was completely unaccounted for, nobody had anticipated that something like this could even happen, um, had led down this series of events where you're now worried about the rent, and now you're worried about getting a job, and you have to accept this one role that you don't even like that much, and the manager's not treating you well, but you can't leave because you have to make rent for the next month. And all right, well, let's say you do your job, you're doing everything as much as well as you can, but then you know, circumstances beyond your control uh get into play because of a pandemic or macroeconomic forces, and then they cause you know the company to not perform well and have to let you go. Uh, it just set off it just that was my first lesson on why it's important to be financially responsible.

SPEAKER_03:

It's it's amazing how like certain moments uh almost feel like they're just meant to happen so that Allah can steer you in a different direction. And it just kind of feels like this was one of those moments in your life where it brought you to where you are now. But I also just wanted to share a few things about you before we uh get into the meat of the conversation. Uh Arib Kawaja is a financial services professional and financial literacy educator who specializes in helping Canadian Muslims build confidence in their personal finances. Uh, with a background spanning engineering, design, and technology, Arib brings a unique, human-centered approach to financial literacy, uh, blending clear education with practical values-based guidance. His mission is to help people, especially young professionals and growing families, achieve financial stability and peace of mind. So thank you again for coming onto the podcast.

SPEAKER_04:

My pleasure. Thank you for hosting me.

SPEAKER_03:

When I think about single Muslims and when they are looking to get married and just begin that journey, of course, like investing and savings and thinking about RSPs and all that stuff, that's that's like nowhere near their mind, right? Like the first thing they're probably thinking about is like, I need to get a job, I need to be financially stable so I can just get married, because they just want to get married at that point. But that's also the one thing that's probably hurting them at that point, too, because thinking long-term is also very important, especially at that stage in your early 20s. So can you share a little bit about the right mindset to have uh when preparing for that big step of getting married uh from a financial standpoint?

SPEAKER_04:

Absolutely. Firstly, thank you, Zayd and Hebba, for inviting me to your podcast. It's an absolute uh honor to be uh part of your community. And uh I wanted to give a quick disclaimer that I'm here not as a representative of my full-time employer, uh TELUS, but as a personal representative uh advocating for financial literacy. And uh one thing that uh you know I'd like to share is that you know, despite my background coming from you know engineering, I studied you know electrical engineering and then followed that up with a master's. And what I found was after 25 years of education, nobody had sat me down and actually explained to me how personal finances work, right? And nobody had said to me, this is how you do budgeting, this is how if you end up in a situation where you have debt, this is how you should manage your debt, this is how uh you know investments work. What are halal investments? Nobody had had those conversations with me. And I remember at uh Eptelus at the end of the year, after a year, years worth of based off of a year's worth of performance, you get a bonus, um, a performance bonus. And HR had explained to me, hey, like Arab, if you transfer this bonus to your RRSP, then you won't have to pay taxes up front on uh on this income. And I had sat there looking very confused, like, oh, what's an RRSV? Oh, um, taxes, how does that work? What what amount of taxes would I normally have to pay? And I looked at the options that they had shared about where I could invest that money through my RRSV, and I remember sitting very confused, like, am I allowed to actually put my money in there? Are these even halal? Does this make any sense? I don't know if I'm allowed to do this or not. Um, and that was really the turning point for me. That's where I decided I wanted to educate myself more about personal finances. And as I as I embarked on this journey and I started learning more and more about uh personal finance, I realized that there was such a gap within our community, the Muslim community, when it comes to uh managing money and personal finances. It's often seen as a taboo topic, right? It's something that we see as you know private and we shouldn't share it with anyone, we shouldn't talk about it with anyone. Uh we have, we of course, as Muslims, have a belief that our risk comes from Allah, but along with that, Allah SWT has made us responsible for how we manage our resources as well. And we often tend to forget, you know, you know, what that means. And you know, that's that's really where I would like to begin when I think about your question, Zayd. Uh, for a young Muslim, uh, maybe in their early 20s, uh, they're just learning about personal finances and they want to know where to start. There are three things that I I think are very fundamental that they should they should know about. Uh one, you know, if your financial journey is kind of like setting up a home. You have different layers of where you need to be thinking, what you need to be thinking about. But the first foundation is having an emergency fund in case something were to happen, just like my jet ski story, right? Um, you want to be in a position where if you, you know, if an accident happens or you lose your job, or you know, you suddenly have a fridge that isn't working anymore, and now you have to buy a new fridge for the home, you can actually pay for this and not be set back. And unfortunately, this is a very basic uh principle that often gets ignored. Um, you know, over half of Canadians are living paycheck to paycheck. And if they were to uh get a sudden expense that they weren't, you know, uh anticipating due to some sort of emergency, they would be, you know, they would have to take a loan to make it, you know, to make ends meet. Uh, and that's over half of Canadians, despite living in one of the richest countries in the world, right? Um, so the first thing I would recommend is start building your emergency fund before dreaming big. Most people jump straight into investing. What are the what are the best stocks that I can get? What are the best funds that I can get? What's the highest ROI that, you know, the returns that I can get? Um, you know, or they they think about, oh, I have to buy a house, so let me put some money aside so I can buy a house. But before you think of any of those things, the most important thing for you is let's establish your foundation. Let's make sure you're you can take care of yourself in case something were to happen. You need to have an emergency fund. It protects your dignity, it protects your mental health, and it helps set you up for your future goals as well. And your 20s, especially for young Muslims, I must say this, your 20s are full of risk. You're going to encounter job changes, you're going to have unexpected expenses come up, life transitions. I had mentioned people looking to get married, right? Um, and having that safety cushion changes your entire trajectory because now you're not dependent on you know um sudden things coming up completely ticking you off your trajectory. So I think that's one of the foundational things that uh that people need to do. The other thing is, secondly, we are so willing to pay everyone else. We'll pay Starbucks, right, for coffee, we'll pay Netflix, we'll pay the utility bills, we'll pay you know our car insurance and our gas bills and all of those things, but we don't pay ourselves, right? And there's a whole mindset around paying ourselves first. When you get your income and it's deposited in the bank, it's that's not 100% your money. We need to change this perspective. Everyone thinks, oh, I've earned this income, now it's my money. No, you have expenses, you have bills that you've incurred, you've got to pay rent. So that's gonna be deducted. It's not, you can't think of it as your money. You got to expense that, right? You whatever, you know, whatever you're left with at the end of the day is what people tend to think is their money. And we got to flip that. We have to start paying ourselves first so that we can live within our needs, not beyond our means, and then just say whatever is left. So I know this sounds boring, but one of the best things that I recommend is automating um, you know, your savings and your bill payments. You can make sure your bill payments happen on time if you automate them. Uh you don't have to rely on remembering them, you don't have to rely on uh willpower. Uh, and you can also automate your investments as well. So you could put money as soon as it hits your bank account on a certain date, you can have it transfer to your tax-free savings account or an RRSP or another, even just another account where you're not going to touch it and you know you're not going to touch it, it's your savings. And people who automate early save way more over their lifetime. Uh, in my story, I mentioned that you know the second most expensive mistake that I made was that jet ski uh incident. The first most expensive mistake I made was not investing early enough. Had I just gotten started investing at 18 or whenever I got my first paycheck, right, the the say the amount that I would have saved by then and how much it would have grown would have, you know, would have just really set me up, you know, at a different position in my life at this point. So, you know, start early, invest early, and have an emergency fund, automate um as much as you can so that it's not dependent on your on your willpower and your ability to remember that you have to pay the bills and you have to save for yourself, pay yourself first, and you can start investing with even tiny amounts. These things compound quite a lot. Even if you're just setting aside$25,$50 a month, you know, that amount actually compounds over time. It will grow over the course of a year, two years, three years. And when you look back at it, you'll realize that, oh, that$50, because I was investing it every month, um, instead of you know getting, which is which is probably you know equivalent to getting a coffee every day, right? You maybe skip out on that coffee, um, but it will set you up in a different position in life. And then it will be easier for you to make, you know, to pursue marriage and to talk about weddings, wedding-related expenses, and you know, buying a home later on because you've set yourself for success early enough.

SPEAKER_01:

Okay, so we'll get inshallah into investment. But um, first of all, what is the best way to prepare your emergency fund? Like just regular savings account or a TFSA? What is a TFSA? Tell us about that.

SPEAKER_04:

Wow, okay, great questions. So let's start with um the first question there. Uh, what is the best way to invest in, or what is the best way to set up your emergency fund? So everyone has a different investment strategy. The best thing that you need to do for yourself is determine what are your what is your income coming in every month, what are your expenses, what are your nice to have that you know that you can reduce, right? Um, and how what amount of money do you have left over that can be set aside? Now, if you have a certain income coming in and a certain set of set expenses, you want to have enough money saved uh saved over in your emergency fund that you can take care of yourself for at least three to six months if your income goes away. For example, you are let's say you're earning you know$3,000 a month and you're expending, you're spending, let's say,$2,000 every single month, right? Uh maybe you save that$1,000 so that in case something were to happen, you lose your job, right? Um, you end up in a position where you've saved enough that you can take care of yourself for three to six months while you look for another job. So that's that's typically the best sort of approach towards um towards setting up an emergency fund. And one other thing that I would recommend is just, you know, don't um like the the mindset that a lot of people have nowadays is they they they spend everything and then whatever is left, they think about saving that. That's that's not how saving works. You got to pay yourself first. Otherwise, we have something called um the the um the standard of living inflation, which means that as your income rises, your expenses also rise to match that. Uh, and if you keep that up, then you will always be living hand to mouth. You will never have enough uh you know ready to be saved so that you can you can start building your emergency funds. So the first thing you have to do is you have to set aside money for yourself, and then you you decide what your expenses are going to be to pay for everything else. So that's you know, that's uh one thing that I would I would recommend. Coming to your second question about a tax-free savings account. So this is a government facility. This is a um a uh like a government registered account that uh the government of Canada provides. And what it allows you to do is you can you can invest in different investments through this account. It's called a TFSA or tax-free saving account, and it allows you to grow your investment tax-free, right? And you can withdraw this money at any time, but any time that this this money grows, whenever you withdraw it, it won't be taxed. So let's say you invested like$10,000. Um, if that grows to like$100,000, that entire$100,000 is non-taxable. You can withdraw it and it will not be taxed. And it's one of the best ways to start preparing for weddings or you know, marriage-related expenses or buying a house, uh, because you can withdraw that money at any time.

SPEAKER_01:

I bet most of our listeners didn't know about this, like uh including us. We just recently learned about this and what it is and RRSP, TFSA, and uh, I think you mentioned a few other types of accounts. So unfortunately, like growing up, we learn about so many things, about uh the dean, which is the most important thing in our lives, of course. We learn about health, we learn about different types of education, but we don't get uh any financial literacy education. And then we learn about it late. Like you said, it was your uh biggest mistake. And um, I I bet you're not the only one.

SPEAKER_04:

Yeah, absolutely. And I think it has a lot to do with the fact that um a lot of people feel that you know personal finances is very personal, so they don't feel comfortable sharing it with other people, and there's this taboo around talking about finances, right? And because of that, we don't share our knowledge with each other either within our community. And this is one of the things that we have to we have to change within our community, the Muslim community, because we should be at the very forefront of using our money wisely, right? Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala has given us these resources as an amanah for us to use wisely, right? Um, and the better that we are able to use this this money, uh, the more we can advocate for the causes that we care about within our community. The the better we're in a in a spot and to to support our our causes, the both the more you know uh we'll be able to advocate for the well-being of the Muslim community, right? And it all comes down to our finances and how we think about the resources that we have.

SPEAKER_01:

Beautiful, beautiful. Uh, do these types of accounts also apply in the states, by the way, or is it just a Canadian thing?

SPEAKER_04:

The these accounts in particular are Canadian. In the US, they have their own government-registered accounts called a Route IRA or a 401k. Uh, both of these are very similar to our RRSP and uh TFSA accounts. Uh, and someone interested in investing in them should talk to a financial advisor licensed in the US to learn more about how they can they can contribute to that and how they can go about setting one up.

SPEAKER_01:

Okay, you mentioned RRSP. What is that?

SPEAKER_04:

Yeah, that's a great question. So um just like how we spoke about the TFSA, which is a government registered account, um, which is a tax free savings account, we the government has also created a government registered account. Registered investment vehicle and account called RRSP, a registered retirement savings plan. And RRSP allows people, it's basically it incentivizes people to save for their retirement. This is a facility that the government offers so that people are more proactive, you know, when it comes to planning for their retirement. And you can put money into this account. When you put money into this account, you won't be taxed in that year for that income. But whenever you withdraw that money, either when you're retired or when you know if you need it at any point in your life, whenever you withdraw that money, you will be taxed at that time. Now, of course, the advantage is if you withdraw it when you're retired, your income from will from your job will be no longer there. So your tax bracket will be a lot less, right? And so when you withdraw it, you can withdraw it at a much lower tax bracket. And then of course, through the RRSP, they can invest in all sorts of different investments, uh, stocks and uh you know ETFs and mutual funds and things like that. So all of these things are accounts and think of it like a bucket, and what you choose to put inside that bucket is the investment. So you can open an account that's the RRSP, and then in that you can make an investment like an like uh you know, like a stock or buying a fund or things like that. Um, and you know, another thing I should mention is that there is a limit to how much money you can put into your into your RRSP, and it can also be used for other purposes uh as well. So the government has set a contribution limit. Anyone can check what their contribution limit is by going on the CRA website. As soon as you log into the CRA website, you will see how much capacity you have left over for your RRSP contribution. Uh and it adds up every single year, and the the government is always you know changing it and adding to it so that you know people can plan for their retirement appropriately. Uh but another another you know few benefits that people should know about their RRSP is that it doesn't just have to be a retirement savings account. It can also be used for uh making uh a purchase of your first home. So you can withdraw that money and make a purchase of your first home without having to pay any taxes. Uh or you know, alternatively, you can also uh withdraw up to$20,000 to pay towards a full-time education, higher higher post-secondary education as well. So if you're doing a master's degree uh and you want to pay for that tuition, you can pay for it using money from your RRSP account as well without having to pay taxes on that.

SPEAKER_03:

Um I want to zoom in on taxes. Taxes is kind of like the the boogeyman in the room, you know, it's like it just creeps up on you, you get your first paycheck, and all of a sudden it's just there. And so you mentioned uh TFSA, RSP. Are what are some other ways, halal ways, of course, that we can reduce our tax burden? Because it always seems like it's one of those things that's reserved for the wealthy people. Wealthy people are always getting away with not paying much tax. But um, what are options for single people, young people who are students, especially?

SPEAKER_04:

Yeah, those that's a great question. So you touched upon the most common that will apply for most people. Uh, your tax-free savings account is a great way for you to grow your investment without having to pay any taxes on the growth of that. If, for example, you were to invest in something outside of your tax-free savings account, whatever the growth of that is, you would have to pay capital gains tax on it, right? Um, so that that tax applies there. Uh similarly with your RRSP, if you're getting an income, you can put that money into your RRSP and you can save money that way and not have to pay taxes immediately. So people can think about their tax strategy uh in terms of three buckets. There's tax now, tax later, and tax advantaged. Tax now are all the things that you do right now that will get taxed immediately. If you buy a stock through a regular bank account and the stock grows and then you sell it, you're gonna have to pay capital gains tax. Or uh you're getting you know your income from your job, you know, there's taxes immediately applicable on that. Or you buy something, you have to pay taxes on that. Uh tax later are you know things like your RRSP. So you put money into your RRSP or you're investing through your RRSV, you won't be taxed at this time. Whenever you decide to withdraw it, you will be taxed at that time. And then your taxed advantaged are the opportunities like your tax-free savings account that will allow you to invest, grow the money, and then whenever you're withdrawing it, it won't be taxed because that growth has uh is is from a tax-free savings. Uh, there's another uh option that uh young Muslims can look into called the first home savings account, FHSA. And this is for people that are looking to buy their first home. It combines uh the advantages of both the RRSP and the TFSA. So, for example, you can contribute uh money in that in that year and you won't have to pay taxes in that year for that money that you've put in. And whenever whenever that money has grown and you've decided to take it out, you also won't be taxed on the growth of that money either. So that's an FHSA first home savings account. Um and you know, some people choose not to buy a home later on in their life. They can still make use of this because they can then transfer your you know your the savings that you have in your FHSA to your RRSP instead if they don't want to buy, they choose not to buy a home in the future. So these are some strategies that people can use to reduce their taxes and and try to and try to optimize for how how they do their their savings.

SPEAKER_01:

So you said with first home uh buyer's account, you don't pay tax on that year. And you also when you withdraw it, you don't pay tax.

SPEAKER_04:

That's exactly right. Yes. And first home savings savings account, FH.

SPEAKER_01:

And you can use it even like to buy something else, not not a house.

SPEAKER_04:

No, no. So because it's a first home savings account, you have to use it to buy a house. However, if you decide that you are not going to buy a house, you can transfer it to your RRSV. If you withdraw it, if you withdraw money from your FHSA at any point and you're choosing not to buy a home at that in that year, you will have to pay taxes on that. Because the purpose of this account was to enable you to purchase your first home. If you don't use it for that purpose, then there will be uh a taxes applicable.

SPEAKER_01:

Okay, okay, okay. Um, do you notice that uh people from other communities have more financial literacy uh than Muslims?

SPEAKER_04:

I I think that this is a common problem because I grew up here, right? And I went through 25 years of education, right? All throughout my elementary school, high school, you know, undergrad, and masters, it was never really emphasized to me how important it is for me to think about budgeting and savings and investments and all and planning for my future, planning for retirement, all of saving on taxes, how to file taxes. Nobody told me how to how to even file my taxes in school, right? And this is something that we're all legally required, it's mandatory for us to do. We have to file our taxes, but they don't teach us how to file our taxes in school. So I think that this is something that is a gap within our education system. I think that our education system needs to uh you know, uh needs to emphasize more the importance of personal finances. And I like I think one of the things that is very interesting is that we live in one of the richest countries in the world, but half of the you know, all Canadians are living paycheck to paycheck. And it's not because they're not earning enough money, they're they're learning like you know, they're earning a good amount of money, but there's a lifestyle creep, right? There is life, there's you know, standard of living inflation, and they're not using you know the right uh financial strategies to manage their personal finances. So if something were to happen, like I mentioned that stat that over half the half of uh Canadians, if there was an emergency that happens, you know, they their car breaks down and they need to pay for that, they would have to go get a loan because they don't have emergency funds to pay for that immediately.

SPEAKER_01:

Wow. And also because we live in one of the countries with highest tax rates as well.

SPEAKER_04:

Yes, absolutely. And it's it's so interesting because I feel like the more we are um the more we are ignorant about how to manage our personal finances, the more likely we are to go out and consume things, right? The more likely we are to go and pay for things without thinking twice about how we're using our money. Um so I just think it's interesting that you know these, you know, there's you know, that there's this gap within our community, within our within our population, uh, and it's probably something that the corporations take advantage of so that they can continue to grow their profits.

SPEAKER_01:

SubhanAllah, you know, you mentioned before we started recording that mashallah you're doing an alamiyya course, and you mentioned that one of your favorite uh courses or classes is contemporary issues. And this just makes me think about like how in Arden, if like we were living in a country that would actually follow the Islamic code, then there are no taxes. We wouldn't be paying any taxes. And when people think about Sharia and like Islam and stuff, all they think about is just chopping off hands and whipping people, and but they don't think about other things, like all we have to pay is 2.5% zakalah if we're able to, and if we're not able to, it would be paid to us. But subhanAllah, that's a part of our deen that's like very um, I would say people don't know about, people don't appreciate.

SPEAKER_04:

That's absolutely true. And what's more interesting, what I find very interesting is that the 2.5% is on your wealth. There's no concept of an income tax, right? This is a Western concept, right? You're taxed when you earn money, and then you're taxed when you spend money, and then you're taxed when you die as well. Um, all of these things, they can really chip away at your capacity. So I I think that, you know, um the fact that within within our within Islam and within our community, it's really emphasized that you know we're taxing wealth, which is what you are going to be, you know, what you're going to have left over, the assets that you're going to have left over after you've paid for all of your expenses, it enables people to be you know more sustainable in the long term. Uh, and another you know interesting concept related to you know um the Islamic financial system is that we also are not supposed to engage in interest. Interest is haram, right? Uh I think that uh what a lot of people often overlook is when they leave their money in the bank, especially in Western countries, um, they might feel satisfied that they're not earning any interest. They've left it in their checking account, and their checking account is the emergency fund there, right? Um they might realize, okay, well, we're earning zero interest, but the bank is what what is what are they going to do with that money? They're going to they're going to take it, and the bank is in the business of loans. They're going to give loans on that. They're going to give credit card loans, they're going to give line of credits, and they're going to give mortgages and car loans. Uh, and all of these things have interest, and they're going to be earning money off of your, they're going to be earning interest off of your money. So indirectly, we'll still be supporting an interest-based system. Uh, and the better thing for us as Muslims to do would be to invest our money in equity-based systems in a halal way uh that is not that is not involving ourselves into riba, right? Keeping it pure from ribba or or enabling a system that is earning ribba from our money, uh, and gives us the ability to vote with our dollars. We can support companies uh that are doing good work in the world, right? Um, and have more control, have our you know, a stronger voice in how those companies are building out their policies if we have more uh Muslim-led investors and investment groups. And right now, the financial system in North America does not cater to our growing Muslim population and community. Uh, but there's a but you know a big portion of a big reason behind that is because we haven't realized these opportunities for us to use our dollars productively when we invest them. If we started investing more money within uh the halal economy, I think the financial system will realize, hey, there's a need here, there's a community here that's willing to invest, let's start catering to them, let's create more Sharia compliant programs and and funds to support them.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So the money that sits in the uh RRSP or TFSA accounts, it's zakatable, right?

SPEAKER_04:

That's right. You are um you have, you know, that is part of your wealth. You're accumulating wealth in that, and you're not using that uh as part of your expenses for anything uh on an ongoing basis, so you should be paying zakat on that, absolutely.

SPEAKER_03:

So you kind of alluded towards loans, but I want to focus more on student loans and debt, because chances are if you're a single Muslim, you're in your mid-20s, you probably have a ton of student debt. So, what's the smartest way to structure repayments so you know young people aren't drowning and also to kind of help them save for marriage?

SPEAKER_04:

Yes, all of these are great questions. So a lot of people unfortunately are in positions where they have multiple types of loans. So they have student loans, and then they might also have a car and they have car loans, and then they have their credit card, they're spending money off of that, and they have those loans. One of the things that we recommend is let's let's take a tiered approach. Which uh which account is uh easy for us to pay off immediately and has the most interest right now, right? Um, let's pay that first. So, for example, if you have credit card debt, credit card debt is typically around 21%, 22% interest, and that's usually the highest interest. So let's let's clear all of that as much as as much as we can, right? Um then we have like other types of loans. So, for example, if you have purchased a car, uh you know, the interest on that, depending on what that is, maybe we tackle that next. And then we have student loans. And then in Ontario, uh, if you've taken, for example, OSAP, the Ontario Student Assistance Program, uh, then you've gotten a loan from both the federal government and the provincial government. Uh, they have pooled their money and given you a loan, and their terms are different. So the federal government uh loan portion is at 0% interest, they're not charging any interest on that, but the provincial government is charging an interest, and that interest starts, to the best of my knowledge, from what I what I remember, um, is it starts accruing as soon as you graduate, and uh you don't have to start making payments until six months after, but it does start accruing interest as soon as you graduate. Um, so my recommendation would be one of the things that students can do is they can write a check uh to the um to the uh OSAP administration for the provincial portion of their loan directly. They haven't made this available through the online portal, uh, but they can actually write a check directly to the uh Ontario government for the Ontario portion of their loans, and they can pay that off immediately uh up front. And then they can keep the pro the federal government loan and pay it off in the installments that are are are suggested. There's no interest on that, so that's okay. Uh my recommendation would be to start paying off loans uh where you have a higher interest rate, like your credit card debt or your you know, maybe car loans or things like that. So that's one thing that I would I would recommend.

SPEAKER_01:

Hey, if you have a story to tell, we'd love to have you on. Here you'll find a safe space of listeners who can understand what you're going through. Just shoot us an email with a summary of your story at info at halalmaj.ca. Investments. That's uh something you mentioned quite uh like many times in our conversation. Where should somebody start with investments? We're talking to single Muslims who are maybe in their mid to late 20s, early 30s, and they have no idea about investments.

SPEAKER_04:

Yeah, great question. And before we even get into investments, what we recommend or what I recommend is doing an analysis of what your goals are, right? Where do you want to be in the next three to five years? Are you saving for marriage, right? Is that one of your goals? How much are you planning on spending on your marriage, right? On your wedding? Are you planning on buying a car in the short term? Are you planning on taking a vacation trip, right, to another part of the world maybe? Uh, do you have student loans that you want to pay off in the next in the short term? So make a list of all of your goals. Based off of what your goals are in the next three to five years, to 10 years, to the next 30 years, that's how we define your financial strategy. The, you know, it's not just a I know when we talk to a lot of people, they often ask us, oh, what are the funds or the stocks that will get me the highest returns? Right? That's what everyone is interested in. How do we get the highest returns, the best returns? And that's not what personal finance is about. It's not about getting the best returns. It's about getting the best returns for you based off of your life circumstances, based off of your goals. We want to help you achieve your goals. Um, and you know, the best way to do that is first writing down what your goals are that you're trying to achieve. If you don't know what your goals are, uh then you're kind of drifting in in the wind. You could be saving, so you'll follow some advice one day, and then someone will tell you, oh, gold is going up, invest in gold. Um, and then another day you might follow another advice, and someone will say, Oh, no, like, look, these tech stocks are doing really well, they're outpacing gold. Please invest in these tech stocks. Um, and because you haven't written down and determined what your goals are, you'll just be, you know, like airy fairy flying in the wind, any which way, right? Um, the first most important thing is to identify your goals. Figure out what your income is, what are you making every month, what are you spending your money on, right? And how much do you have left over uh to do investments with or to do savings with, to do the emergency fund with. Uh, and then based off of that, we would recommend okay, set aside a certain amount for your emergency fund, um, keep long-term savings invested. Uh, don't put them in like a, you know, like a low interest savings account. Uh, you won't get as many returns. Also, you know, don't support uh interest-based uh savings either. Um so we recognize that you know cash loses value every year because of inflation. So you want to outgrow the pace of inflation in order to grow your money. So you want to have a strategy that diversifies your investment to keep it safe, but also grows your money beyond the inflation uh rate. Uh so you know, use all the buckets that you have available to you. Use the TFSA for growth assets, you know. Uh the tax-free compounding helps you outpace the inflation. Try to keep your expenses limited so that you can avoid lifestyle creep. You're trying to achieve goals here. There's a purpose towards the money that you're earning. Don't just use it for, you know, um for whatever you feel like spending money on on a given day. Inflation hurts most when spending rises faster than income, right? You let's say you have earned a certain amount of money and then you get a promotion uh and you're making more money, then suddenly you'll feel like, oh, I can go out and I can afford dinners out every every weekend, right? And that is not the best strategy because we have to remind ourselves we're trying to achieve a certain goal. Does having dinners out make us feel you know better, feel better? Or are is it more important for us to have dinners outside every weekend, or is it more important for us to save towards achieving our goals, whether that's marriage or buying a car or buying a home or things like that? So you have to keep that as your reason for savings. And then have a diversified strategy. So uh if you have those short-term goals, don't invest in aggressive funds that are very volatile, even though it looks like they have the highest ROI in the long run. Maybe at the time when you need the money, when you're trying to withdraw from those funds, you might end up in a position where the market is down and then you might be uh withdrawing at a loss, right? And you don't want to be in that position. So try to diversify based off of your goals uh so that you have a staggered approach. If you have a short-term uh goal, uh take a more stable investment. And if you have a long-term goal, that's where you can be more aggressive with your investments. Because even though over over time um the you know, even in the short term, the investment might be volatile, but over time they'll they'll have a higher ROI. So that's so that's what I would recommend.

SPEAKER_01:

Okay, I I hear this and I hear discipline. I I mean this is sounds like a good way to teach you how to be disciplined, even if you're not the type. But like you said, automating um just forces you to be disciplined. But let's say I figured out my goals, I calculated my income, my expense. Expenses. I've opened an RRSP account. I opened a TFSA account. Now what do I do? Do I pay someone to invest my money? Do I go and choose one of the stocks? What are funds? What should I do?

SPEAKER_04:

So you should talk to a financial advisor, a financial expert, so that they can give you the best advice for your situation. You can even talk to your bank representative. You can get a personal financial advisor as well. And they can help you decide on the best strategy for yourself. And then also nowadays we have lots of online resources that people can tap into. So for example, get smartaboutmoney.ca is a really great website that people can go to to learn about all of these different investment vehicles like RRSPs, TFSAs, how to optimize for their taxes, all of that great stuff. And then also look at uh look at what uh is happening in the market right now. Like are there uh are there certain funds that are performing really well? What what's the reason behind that? Don't make your own assumption. Try to talk to experts and understand you know their perspective on this. Um it's you know, there's a lot of like do-it-yourself work that happens nowadays. A lot of people download wealth simple and then they can invest in stocks, they can invest in ETFs. Uh, but the challenge with that is that they don't have that discipline or that habit built in or that financial knowledge uh to guide them when they're doing these things themselves. And so they feel empowered, like, oh, I can open my own TFSA account and I can invest in these ETFs through my TFSA account, and that's that's great. If you have the if you're informed, if you have that financial knowledge uh and you feel like that's you know a comfortable uh option for you, you know, why not go for it? But if you are looking for you know someone that can guide you, support you, uh, and provide you that personalized uh advice based off of your your uh situation and your needs and actually sit down with you and do like a regular assessment with you, uh it's a good idea to talk to a personal financial advisor and get that support from them as well. When we need support for anything else in our lives, we like to consult people. People go to you know a mechanic to ask about car-related advice. They might go to a dentist for you know their for their teeth and you know for regular checkups on how their you know oral hygiene is just like that. We have financial you know advice as well, and there's a whole industry around that and uh that you know that you can tap into experts and get support from.

SPEAKER_01:

And what is a fund?

SPEAKER_04:

Great, okay. So um what so before we get into funds, what's important for us to understand is what is a sh a stock or a share. Uh, these are synonymous, and a share is just like the name says, a share of ownership within a company. So let's say you have you know an incorporation, you have a big company, and the company wants to raise money in order to pursue a certain project. They want to uh sell bananas from you know India and Canada, and they want to go and they want to buy all of these bananas and they want to bring it over and sell them in Canada. Uh, and to be able to buy these, you know, these bananas, they want they need to have the capital to do that. So what um you know the company owner will do is they will say, Hey, I'm going to sell bits and pieces of my company. I'm going to sell ownership over parts of my company, a share of my company. And when someone buys that, I will get the money and then I'll be able to use that funding to you know uh support my endeavor. Um and you know, they'll sell, let's say, a thousand, they'll create a thousand shares and they'll sell you know different, you know, shares to their uh on a stock exchange, right? And you know, lots of people will say, hey, like I think this company is going to do really well. I really like this idea about selling bananas in Canada. So their stock is gonna go up because it seems like a really legit business plan. Let's go buy you know ownership in this company, let's go buy a share of this company. So they'll go and they'll buy a share of that company. Um now they've become part partial owners, they've they've gotten a share of ownership in that company. If that company's value goes up, their the value of their share of that company will also go up. If that company's value goes down, then their share of ownership of that company will also go down. So that's a that's a share. A fund is basically taking a pool of money from lots of different investors and buying lots of different shares across lots of different companies. It could be companies in a certain industry, so across the board, you could be investing in an in an industry-based fund or a sector-specific fund. It could be diversified, it could be uh within a specific region, or it could be global. Uh, each fund has its own strategy on how it's investing that money. Uh, but the basic idea here is that we're taking small uh own bits and pieces and ownership of lots of different companies across the board using the funds that or the money that people have have invested. So you can have, you know, um uh you can have funds of different sizes. So the larger the fund is, you also want to look at you know what their investment strategy is. Is this an aggressive portfolio? Are they investing in companies that are uh that are more volatile but their outlook is to grow very you know very fast? Uh or is this a more stable portfolio? Are they looking at investing in companies that are going to be returning more, you know, um more average returns, but they're you know they're going to keep their value. All of these things are provided in a document called fund facts. So if you're going to invest in a fund, well, the most important thing for you to do is to do your research on what the strategy is for that specific fund and if it's the right uh investment for you. And you can find those details in the fund facts document. It will tell you which companies this fund is invested into, how much you know of their allocation is in different types of companies, where these companies are, are they you know sp specific to a region or geographic region? Are they across the board? Are they with within a specific sector? Uh, and what's the investment style of the portfolio manager as well?

SPEAKER_01:

Okay, and are there funds that are halal and others that are haram?

SPEAKER_04:

Yes, absolutely. So just like any sort of financial uh investment, funds can also have to meet the same criteria uh for them to be considered halal. Um so when we're looking at halal finance, there are certain uh criteria that we have to meet in order to make sure that these um where per it's permissible for Muslims to invest in them. Firstly, we have to look at um the industry that you know these companies are, the the what the company actually does. For example, is it doing something that is going to be harmful for society, for humanity, for our Muslim community? Uh for example, things like weapons manufacturing, alcohol, gambling, right? Um, things like tobacco or uh companies that are producing um uh you know products that aren't uh you know that aren't uh suitable for for human consumption, right? All of these things, if they're deemed harmful to society, uh these are prohibited industries. If this company operates in this space, that means it's earning its income in a non-halal way. And remember what I said about stocks or shares. You're basically buying ownership into a small piece of that company. That means that you've if you invest in a company that is in a prohibited industry, you are buying ownership in that company. You will also be accountable for how that company is, you know, is acting, right? Uh, because you have ownership in that. So the first thing you have to do is you have to check if that you know that company is producing things that you know meet these criteria. They have to be, you know, industries that are that have that you know that are permissible for Muslims to invest in. The other thing is, and there are lots of different uh standards that are set by uh Islamic scholars. So there's AOFI, there is Islamic Financial Advisory Board, uh, so there's there are lots of different uh you know committees and standards set by these Sharia compliance boards. Um you can see if that company has gotten a review done or has met some sort of compliance requirements uh to be you know to be approved, to uh to be considered a sharia compliant uh uh fund. In Canada, this and you know, in general, but in Western countries, uh there aren't that many. It's a growing industry. There they are trying to cater to the Muslim community more. Uh, but uh we as Muslims have to really show that we are looking for these sorts of products, we're looking for Sharia compliant halal products for us to invest in. Otherwise, if we don't vote with our dollars, then they won't know that there is a need here uh for them to for the financial industry to meet. So those are two things that I would recommend. And then the third thing that often gets overlooked, but it's extremely important, is corporate social responsibility. And that is, let's say like the company is you know selling like coffee, right? There's a certain company that's selling coffee, and there's nothing wrong with selling coffee and they're they're earning their income from selling coffee. But even though they're earning their income in a halal way, if they're spending that money to harm Muslims in a different part of the world, like Gaza, for example, that would be something that we as Muslims cannot support, right? And we're directly enabling that by buying a piece of that company and having ownership in that company, and that is wrong for us, right? So we have to be very careful because there will be accountability on the day of judgment for us as Muslims, um, on how we used our money and if we enabled or had ownership or a share in the oppression that is happening around the world.

SPEAKER_01:

Absolutely. I would stretch that a little bit more, even uh if the company is using that money to harm other communities, not necessarily just Muslims.

SPEAKER_04:

Absolutely. Absolutely. If they're doing any sort of um harm upon humanity in general, right? Um and if they're if they're facilitating you know uh harm on any any human community anywhere in the world, absolutely, we should not be supporting that. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03:

Uh you mentioned um stock, you talked a little bit about stock ownership and shares. Um with that also, and correct me if I'm wrong, also comes the possibility of getting paid with dividends. Um so can you expand a little bit about that, how that works, and um, you know, and how investing in um halal companies opens up that door?

SPEAKER_04:

Yes, that's a great question. So, what is a dividend? A dividend is a payout of profit from a company. So, for example, let's say the three of us, you know, myself, Hiba, and Zayd, we decide to start a company and we're going to sell bananas in Canada. All right, so we have a thousand bananas and we sell these bananas in Canada, and we make, let's say, ten thousand dollars from these bananas. Because we each own, let's say, a third of the shares of that company, uh, we will each be entitled based off of what we decide to do with that money. For example, some companies like to distribute the profits of that um that they've earned to their shareholders, and they'll set like uh commitments as well. So they'll have a policy. They'll say, okay, if you have a share in our company, we'll give you X amount of profit from our annual, you know, annual uh uh review. And so within our company will get like a third of the profits each. Some companies will say, actually, no, our policy is not that we're gonna distribute the profits, we're going to reinvest all of those profits into the company for further RD, for further sales and marketing, for further development. We're just gonna invest all of that money into our business. So you have to look into what the policy is of those companies. If they have a dividend-paying policy, uh, then that's great because then you get an extra income source just by having ownership in a piece of that company, you will be getting paid a dividend from the profits. Uh, and that dividend you can use to you know further reinvest in your savings, in your investments, or you can use that yourself. You can maybe that's something that you want to use to pay for your expenses instead. You never take money out of your principal, you just take the dividends and you use the dividends to pay for your expenses. So that's also a strategy that a lot of people do as well.

SPEAKER_01:

Okay, cool. Um, a lot of our clients mention when we ask them what are what are your goals for the next five years, a lot of them mention uh start a side hustle, side hustle, start a side gig. What are some tips you can give uh single Muslims or not single, but uh someone who's interested in starting a side hustle?

SPEAKER_04:

Oh gosh, that's a great question. So I think there's a lot to be said about entrepreneurship. I think that uh there's a lot of uh benefit for our community if we have more people that are looking for you know problems to be solved and trying to address issues in the community by and filling those needs within the community and and they're getting paid for it. That's fantastic, right? They're delivering real value. Uh, and so I would encourage everyone to look into you know pursuing some sort of entrepreneurship. Um, I think what a lot of people often overlook is that it's really hard to get established as an entrepreneur. And people get very passionate, so they'll you know, leave their full-time job and they'll go directly into their entrepreneurial you know endeavor, their enterprise uh and their idea, and they haven't built a clientele, they haven't you know established a consistent recurring source of income, uh, they haven't spoken to customers as an example to actually see if there is a you know that problem within the community, or if there is a problem uh that they can solve, how much are people willing to pay for it? They haven't done the homework, they haven't done the background research to be able to validate that this is something that they can sustain themselves on. Uh so that's one thing that I would recommend. Um, keep your full-time job, right? And try to uh try to do your your background homework, your research, like build clientele, talk to customers, see if they're willing to pay, how much are they willing to pay for you to solve that problem? How much time does it take for you to solve that problem for them? How much is it costing you? Because there's a cost of goods sold or cost of uh value of you know of services offered as well, right? Is it gonna cost you more? It's gonna take you more time uh to be able to offer this service for them and they're willing to pay you, but at the end of the day, your costs are higher than what they're paying you, then you're in the red at the end of the day, and you won't be able to sustain that business. So, all of these things I think people tend to overlook. But uh, I think it's important for people to experiment with entrepreneurship and try things out for themselves because it can be a very fulfilling path for them. Uh, it can really help them, especially in today's economy where you know a lot of layoffs are happening, there's a lot of volatility. We now have AI. AI is taking lots of people's jobs, it's automating people's jobs, and there's this anxiety like, oh, what are we going to do now? Like, if AI does my job, I I won't, you know, I'll be out without an income. It's important for people to have you know other sources of income, to have their finances in order, and then, you know, and and you know, some some some other way for them to sustain sustain themselves in case something were to happen with their primary uh you know employment. Um so I would always recommend that, yeah.

SPEAKER_03:

Um so let's say a single Muslim came to you today, uh, with zero dollars saved, zero invested, an average job, and maybe even some debt. What's the exact 90-day plan you would put them on to transform their their financial direction?

SPEAKER_04:

That's a great question. So I think the first thing that I would do once again is let's look at what your goals are. What are you trying to achieve, right? Let's take a look at your expenses, let's take a look at your income. Do you have any debt, right? What are your assets? And let's let's try to define a strategy that will help you achieve your goal and let's see if we can get you set up that way. For the first 30 days, I would recommend as we do this is to track every dollar. Let's figure out where are you spending your money, right? Is there certain behaviors that you have that is costing you a lot of money? Do you like to go for coffee every single day? Um, do you, you know, do is there, you know, are you going out to eat a lot, right? Is that something that you could be saving money on? Are you, you know, buying things, you know, off of a whim on Amazon when you see like a sale, when you could be you know potentially saving yourself money there. So let's track every dollar. Then let's just build a$500 starter emergency fund. Let's just build a, or it doesn't have to be$500, let's just build an emergency fund that is right for you, right? Um, but just a certain amount of money that if something were to happen in the next you know few days, a few few weeks, few months, uh, you can fall on fall back on this money and be able to pay your rent, be able to pay your your utility bills, and sustain yourself until you find potentially another place um or another another uh employer. Play pay your debts. Let's figure out your strategy on what sort of debt you owe, which debt you should be you know focusing on first. Let's pay that off first. Open a TFSA if you don't have one, right? It's all it's never too late to start investing. You don't have to start with a whole lot of money to get started with investments. You can start with something small. So open a TFSA and automate your investments. So maybe$25 a month is the right amount for you, but automate it so that you don't have to think about it. You don't have to open your account every single month and transfer that$25. It will just happen automatically for you and you won't even know about it or you won't even think about it. Less you can rely on yourself to do your investing, the better you'll be. There's a saying that you know the best investors are dead people because they leave their money, right? And their pension funds and their RRSPs, and they've passed away and they haven't claimed it because they're pass they passed away, but they're the value of their accounts just keeps growing. And I think there's a stat, don't quote me on this, um, but I believe there's what two two trillion dollars worth of um of like pension funds and RRSP funds that are just sitting there that have gone unclaimed.

SPEAKER_01:

No way.

SPEAKER_04:

Yeah, it's a lot of money. The reason for that is often because people switch jobs and then they forget that they had all of these contributions from their previous employer. So when it's time for them to retire, they might be like, oh, I they they're not gonna remember that you know, 25 years ago or 30 years ago, they had this one RRSP with one employer and they completely forgot about it. Um, so and it just sits there, it's been growing for the last 30 years and it's gone unclaimed. So there's a reason why dead people are the best investors, they don't they don't touch the money.

unknown:

I guess.

SPEAKER_01:

Can I go claim it?

SPEAKER_04:

No, we can't we can't claim it, unfortunately. I'm just joking. If there's a next of kin that is discovered, then that person will claim it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But but the problem is the next of kin doesn't know that this person had this you know RRSP account from 30 years ago that they need to claim now. So, you know, someone has to tell them.

SPEAKER_01:

Uh rent or buy. Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_04:

You're asking the tough questions now. So it's not it's not either or as a definitive answer. It really just comes down to the circumstances that you're in at that time. So a lot of people believe that, oh, if I rent and then whatever extra money that I have that I wouldn't what I've paid in my mortgage or in my home expenses, I'll I'll invest that. And if that investment grows faster than you know uh a house's appreciation, then I will have made more money by renting and you know saving the rest in investments. Uh it's a perfectly good strategy. There's nothing wrong with that. Uh and you never know what market you're going to be in. The housing market doesn't necessarily always have to go up. In 2008, we had a financial market collapse, right? And housing markets, you know, they also fluctuate. House values can go up and down. Um the other the other side of it is people feel more secure when they own a home. You know, a landlord won't kick them out just because they want to increase the rent on a particular day. Um, rents increase, you know, periodically very quickly, whereas your mortgage is set by the bank. So you have to make those payments. You, you know, they're a little bit more stable. Uh, but then you know, houses have their own expenses. Whereas in a you know, in a rental unit, you may not have to pay for lots of different services uh that uh you won't have to get the fridge repaired if something breaks or you know your oven breaks. Whereas in your own house, you have to pay for all of these expenses. So it's not an either or. It's more so about what are you what are you looking to get out of your living situation. Right. A house is an investment as well, but uh I think it says more so about the lifestyle choice that you want to make. Ultimately those I think that you know that will be the deciding factor for you. And a lot of people think that um oh like home ownership is the best way to build up equity and generational wealth for ourselves. That's not necessarily true, right? It can be true, but it doesn't mean that it has to be true 100% of the time. Like home house values go down. You might have a mortgage and then the you know you're paying a lot more for your mortgage than what the house is worth right because of depreciation for any factor that could be outside of your control. Right. So all of these things happen and at the same time people feel that oh if they are if they want to raise a family they want to be more rooted it's important for them to own a home in in a neighborhood where they can raise their kids and be settled for a longer period of time. That's okay too you know other people prefer a different lifestyle. Maybe they want to move around a little bit more they prefer they want to you know pursue other job opportunities that could pay them you know more in the future and so they just want to have something temporary and they'll they want to have the flexibility to go somewhere else. So it just comes down to what are you trying to achieve? What are you trying to do with your life? What stage of life are you in? And that will be the better way to answer the question. Purely from a financial perspective it could go either way.

SPEAKER_01:

I was hoping for a definitive answer. Just makes it easier for us.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah I I'd say for us the the biggest question is is that at the end of the day we can't overlook the fact that there is interest involved in buying a house unless you have a ton of cash. And so yes I know scholars kind of have um their their arguments and and they've made a case for circumstances where it is acceptable or hello to buy a house. But for us I would say it really comes down to necessity. Like can you get by without dealing with the gray area of interest by just renting do you need the large such a large space and so and I'm not like telling everybody who's listening you know go start renting but um but take these things into consideration that is it a necessity or do you really want to be dealing with that gray area of interest and then make a decision accordingly yeah and it's not a it's not a great gray area.

SPEAKER_04:

Let's not try to convince ourselves either way or the other there's only one place in the Quran that Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala has declared war on something. Allah himself has declared and his messenger and it's on Riba right there's no other uh place in the Quran where there's such strict verbiage being used right um so I wouldn't even say that this is a gray area it's very explicit. Now you can make a case that oh like it's out of necessity and that's that's fine. You know that is a personal choice that people are are making. It doesn't make them any less you know of a person and it's a personal choice that they've made but um I don't think it's it's you know enough for us to deny that they're that this is a gray area. It's a very very important aspect of deciding how to spend your you know finances.

SPEAKER_01:

Absolutely absolutely I think sometimes when we want to do something we just find ways to justify it.

SPEAKER_04:

Yes.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah I think we uh lost Zayd Zayd's connection is gone for some reason. But um before we let you go how do you work with people who are looking for to hire financial advice advisor what kind of services do you offer and how can people um contact you?

SPEAKER_04:

Yeah absolutely people can find me at my email address aribquaja1 at gmail.com you can also message me on LinkedIn I'm more than happy to have a chat and listen to you and and learn a little bit more about your financial situation. We can work together to come up with your you know financial strategy for free completely willing to do that and you don't mean I won't charge for you know any financial uh education that I provide or any any um uh any literacy that I provide on personal finances so I'm more than willing to have have a chat uh feel free to contact me uh my email is aribquadja1 at gmail.com or you can find me on LinkedIn as well.

SPEAKER_01:

We can 100% testify to that because um all the literate the financial literacy education we got from you it was completely for free and we're very appreciative because we it's like opening a treasure box. We didn't know about any of this and I'm so glad that we're able to have this uh discussion to also share this information with other listeners.

SPEAKER_04:

So thank you so much for that any advice you would give uh for our single listeners so one piece of advice that I would give going back to like the single biggest mistake you know expensive mistake not the biggest mistake but the most expensive mistake as Muslims it's not enough for us to not do anything right whether that is you know for the social causes that we care about about what's happening in Gaza right or whether it's our personal finances and we just have our money you know sitting in the bank uh it is not enough for us to just not do anything it's important for us to have take to be informed to get educated to take action and to use our resources responsibly that's one of the things that I want to leave people with. This is you know your risk and your you know the the wealth that you've been given is a amana it's a responsibility you should use it in the best way to you know to support yourself to support your family to support those in need to support social causes around the world that you know are in need of our support uh and we are only able to do that if we educate ourselves on our personal finances and if we use our money wisely so start now start saving start thinking about your financial strategy uh you know you don't have to come to me talk to a financial advisor that you trust uh and you know and and do something about uh about planning for your future and you know try to achieve your financial goals I know it's a lot of times we as Muslims you know believe in just having tawaqul in Allah and just leaving it to Allah and to Qatar and Allah will you know provide for us and these are all great. But also the Prophet has said you know trust in Allah and tie the camel tie your camel. So it's important for us to take a proactive approach towards achieving our goals be responsible come up with your own financial plan and and work towards achieving it as well. You do that with every other aspect of your life right you want to you know pursue a career in engineering or medicine you plan to go to you know college or university and you plan your study routine and you plan on you know how you're going to pass exams so that you can go and pursue a career in that field you should think the same way about your personal finances as well.

SPEAKER_00:

Absolutely absolutely really appreciate you mentioning that especially stressing the ethical causes the causes around the world that we have obligation towards whether it's Gaza whether it's Sudan whether it's Congo everywhere the world is suffering and we have a responsibility. Yeah our beautiful listeners we hope you enjoyed this episode brother Arib here is offering free financial education he can help you with building your financial plan all free of charge we took advantage of it and um very happy and uh we hope to do the same. Uh Arib thank you so much for um for your time for sharing all this valuable information for your energy which allow our listeners will see you on the next one.